No To Large Moyo

Invasion between three-space separated stones on the fourth line  

When you are quite weak your first reaction is panic. I am being robbed of my territory!

A connection (basic variation)  

Of course, you know that there is this connection, which saves your territory. You know also that you've just given your opponent a ponnuki and ended in gote. But it saves your territory! Now you can proudly tell that it is yours!

The 4 dan did not like it. Of course, he saw a whole board before him (in some cases this variation is the best thing).

A connection (basic variation - kungfu 3k*)  

In the above variation, Black might have to win a ladder, and has not significantly weakened the two marked white stones in my opinion. -kungfu

zinger: I think that in this diagram is very bad. It should be at .

Bill: I agree. - is ideal for Black.

Charles If anything, is worse than . You might just play when in a position to attack. But is rarely going to be on the correct point: think about a instead.

zinger: Perhaps, but if that is your plan, then at (as below) looks better.

Charles Yes, sometimes. Taking territory while attacking is proverbial. We tend to think of it as 'making a framework with attacking moves'. But it is also good to take territory, i.e. play actually-enclosing moves. (I think this is an example of a basic instructional point that is rarely written down.) In theory, depending on the right-hand direction, it might on occasion be better to play moves that give a smaller framework that is then easier to consolidate (the right-sizing or we can't all be Takemiya approach).

Bill: We have to remember that is dubious. That is particularly so in the case Charles envisions. So we are comparing at , with no mistake by Black, with a sequence that starts with a Black mistake. Besides, what the rest of the board is like is vague.

Now there will be a fight.  

That was an introduction. Now, about the controversial statement. This is a way I invented to calm down my fears of invasion.

another idea (-kungfu 3k*)  

(In the above example by kungfu, Black cannot extend in sente along the bottom as in a normal san san with White on the bottom left. Comments?)

Tewari  

Bill: A little tewari. If Black had invaded with , would White respond with and ?

Yi Ch'ang-ho vs. Yi Se-tol (LG Cup)  

After White's marked move Yi Se-tol played 1 forming a large moyo. Note, that it is not a huge moyo. If the opponent invades the lower right corner, Black has to kill to win the game. White played 2, which I think was a natural move for Black.

Futher in the game White invaded into lower right corner and lived after a long ko fight, forcing resignation.

Joan Pons i Semelis 3d : This kind of position arises quite often in the mini-chinese fuseki, and is not always true that the invasion on the lower right corner stakes the game in a life and death problem. I'll dig to find some examples of this. Also Takemiya Masaki 9 dan was (is ?) very good at letting the opponent life inside his moyos and win nevertheless. But he made "huge" moyos.

Comment on the above by Kungfu: Well, if you make huge moyos, again, let them eat their cake-but use your influence to gain territory and let them live small. Moyo by definition is NOT settled territory! If it is not settled, it is only potential. When you count your moyo, think about how much it is worth after it's been invaded. If it's not enough then you are behind.

Discussion and example of this on Ten Kyu Side Invasion (albeit not at pro level :-)

unkx80: At first looks odd to me, but after thinking for a while, I noticed that Black can treat the stone lightly, and take a and b as miai.

zinger: Agree. Also, I am inclined to wonder why wasn't played at to begin with.