# Largest capture that still can't live / Solution 1

Solution ( at )

Black sacrifices one more stone and plays atari at .

Solution

and capture four white stones (including ). Interestingly the eye space of the White group at the top is not enough to make two eyes, c.f., 212SS notcher. For example, if White a then Black b (bulky five), if White c then Black b (pyramid four).

Failure 1

If Black does not sacrifice one more stone, then White lives.

Failure 2 ( at )

Connecting with fails: black loses more stones without compensation

Solution - White?

Jasonred- ah, I stopped thinking once I saw Black's entire structure there die... I was also wondering about the whole title for this page! (why it's about eye spaces) but ... I was wondering about this following sequence? After , are a and b miai for life?

unkx80: No. Check out nakade. Also check out some of the Beginner Exercises.

Note: White dies in gote after . That is to say, after , Black can play tenuki and White is still dead.

Black kills White?

Jasonred: Let me try this, for Black to kill White... is this the correct sequence? Is in the diagram (Solution) a nakadeafter which White should just play tenuki?

Dieter: The point is, White is dead. In order to prove/disprove that, we have to verify what happens if White goes first, not Black.

Black kills White? (2)

For instance: then makes miai of a and b: White needs both a and b to live, so Black can always play one of them to kill. Verify there is no eye in the corner.

From 16 to 17 eye space nakade?

Jasonred- verify this for me, but, ummm... modifying the above, I think I got a nakade for a 17-space eye... is this correct?

jvt: This eye space cannot possibly result from a capture. If such eye spaces are allowed, it is easy to add cutting points and stones in atari.

Construction

Dieter: The eyespace and ensuing nakade you propose, would have to come from this capture. In your diagram, however there is a stone at a but then Black gets a double capture and is out of trouble already.

Construction 2

Moreover, to get there, Black would have to play here. That's not a smart thing to do: Black will much rather play at or at one of the ataris.

Largest capture that still can't live / Solution 1 last edited by Unkx80 on September 11, 2009 - 12:08