4-4 point, double low approach, outside diagonal

  Difficulty: Intermediate   Keywords: Joseki
[Diagram]
Diagonal answer  

Charles Matthews This diagonal play has experienced a revival in pro games, associated with new thinking about central influence and possible tenuki variations.

After B1 here, W2 at the 3-3 point is normal; and now Black plays a, b, or tenuki allowing White at a.

The problem with this joseki for a weaker player is that Black at a can leave a black wall, but without a pincer attacking white+circle and also with some potential shape problems. Clearly this isn't troubling at pro level, but amateurs can come to grief here.

[Diagram]
Black's answer a  

After W2 Black's main options are at e, f and g. Playing g, which is a move useful in handicap games when Black has a stone already at the circled point to attack white+circle, isn't very forceful here. Black at e is only seen in old games.

[Diagram]
Black cannot tenuki  

After B1, black cannot tenuki. White's shape is too good after W4, W6. If black wants to tenuki, it should be before B1, not after.

[Diagram]
Black presses  

Probably B1 is the best idea here, but the bulge play W2 gives Black some shape difficulties.

[Diagram]
Black presses  

In games of Hane Yasumasa based on the Chinese opening B1, W2, B3 was used to build influence for Black on a large scale, treating the cutting point at a as secondary.

[Diagram]
White's mistake  

This W1 would be a big mistake as it doesn't take advantage of Black's shape problems.

[Diagram]
Joseki  

When black+square is present, this is played in many pro games.


firstian As a beginner, I'm always looking for the "meaning" of a move, so I can think about whether a move makes sense or not, and also how to respond when my opponent doesn't play a book move. I think I understand that either a or c are meant to separate the two stones and develop on one side. What about the meaning of b? For example, in one of my 9-stone handi game, W played:

[Diagram]
Huh?  

I think the correct response to W2 is a. But not knowing what B1 is suppose to do, I have no clue how to develop my corner group. (My guess is that B1 helps B runs out to the center, but is that it?)

20k guess: B1 leaves two possibilities - live in the corner, bigger than if B1 hadn't been played (eg with 3-3), or run into the center (eg with b). In a nine handicap game, black probably isn't clever enough to tell which is better. Therefore, treat them as miai and play somewhere else.


4-4 point, double low approach, outside diagonal last edited by Unkx80 on April 18, 2009 - 21:24
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