# p25, Dia. 16 error in diagram? [#755]

PeterHB: p25, Dia. 16 error in diagram? (2006-11-18 13:06) [#2422]
p25, Dia. 16

There are two s. Considering white appears to be trying to take the corner & push out to the left, what is the correct diagram?

X
71.192.14.64: Re: p25, Dia. 16 error in diagram? (2006-11-18 17:32) [#2423]

Bob McGuigan: Judging from the text in the book the in the corner shouldn't be there. The correct diagram apparently should be:

p25, Dia. 16

The purpose of this diagram is to refute Black's crawling move at . A different book on enclosure joseki, Shimari Gihou by Ishida, says that if Black crawls at and the moves , , and in the following diagram are played the result is about equal:

Ishida variation

Ishida says that there are very few examples in professional play of Black playing atari on top as in:

rare in professional play

tderz: some ideas & diagrams (2006-11-18 17:34) [#2424]

Many years ago I wrote in pencil next to the diagram ' = ?', hence I thought that on the right is .

However (I cannot simply copy your diagram now and do not want to create a new one) Black have only got 4 liberties, and still has 4 liberties + sente.

As painful it is to push once more with , (because it hurts that black hoshi stone ) it is quite big not to lose , instead.

A black attachment at the 3-2 point will not work due to the ladder aji or life in the corner.

[10] possible diagram

tderz: perhaps this is meant

[20] possible development

tderz: next black a and white b captures 3 stones.

[30] White a is sente

tderz: as white a still would be sente now (and white might stir up trouble with b beforehand, perhaps getting a liberty more), it might be a good idea for Black to push once more with a. is hurt

[40] White a is not sente anymore

tderz: White a is not sente anymore

[50] capturing problems

tderz: Black has capturing problems with the 3-2 point attachment.
Purely from the dame counting, it's 4:3 for Black, but once White starts to set her stone into motion with a, the trouble starts, should black block at b or c?

[70] the corner
[80] the corner

tderz: atari ?

[90] the corner
[100] the corner

tderz: Black has to be careful, though as

• White has 4 dame liberties a, d, g, h , while
• Black has effectively only 2 fighting liberties f & i
due to the throw-in at b..

Hence, Black cannot simply approach at a and take liberties away.

[110] the corner

tderz: But atari in diagram [80] was a mistake.
If Black wants to deprive White now of her life, he has to play a whereon White captures at b and Black has to protect the cutting point c by d or so.
Then White can easily win the capturing race by bending at d (if Black has not pushed there multiple times from behind and on the 2nd line beforehand, which would be extremely bad, even bigger than the corner, IMO)

[120] alternative

tderz: White wins capturing race after bending at .

tderz: Black can win this fight after pushing from below with , then going for the corner after Black a, white b, Black c.
However the is strategically dead and the white influence might be worth more than the corner.
This playing style (just looking at the immediate 'cash' (corner)) is for sure not good (IOM).