Tim Brent/Go views

Sub-page of TimBrent

A few observations on my part: (more as I make them)

1 9x9 and 13x13 Go are good and fun in their own right, and I do enjoy playing them, but should not be used as training for 19x19 board, in that the tactics are much different, as for 9x9 Go a very offensive nature is needed, and you need both offensive and defensive skills in Go.

2 The only real difference between a high dan and a low kyu player is that the dan player has for the most part ironed out his mistakes, whereas the low kyu player is still learning from them (hane-tsugi took a long time for me).

3 The reason a computer will never beat a 9p is that a computer has a difficult time with basic pattern recognition - the only complexity in an otherwise extremely simple game.

4 Go is as much about aesthetics as it is about the play.

5 On-line Ratings systems are of no value to gauge your strength. How can one determine their strength when on the result of one game, you can go up or down 2 kyu? The other purpose of Go rating systems being handicapping is useless, as you almost never see handicap games on-line.

6 I find when I can play light, it is better. Go is a game that should not rely on pure brute force.

7 The study of Go turns into the study of Life.

8 Each stone should have two purposes--make a point for you, or deny your opponent a point, whether through capture or dame .

Dieter's comments: (when I write "is", please read "I think")

1. The main difference is that on a 9x9 the game is almost countable exactly. There is little room for intuition. Tactics, reading and calculation account for the mental processes. There is hardly any strategy involved.

Yet I think that 9x9 is an excellent exercise for the real game, precisely because strategy is absent. Newcomers can concentrate on the tactics and learn that precise calculations and deep reading are key to the game. Later when they shift to 19x19, they learn to appreciate the strategic features of go.

2. This is very true. As a dan player, I am constantly analysing my games to see where the errors were in order not to make them again, much rather than looking for excellent moves giving me an immediate advantage.

3. Disagree. At this moment, the computer's calculating abilities are indeed outplayed by man's pattern recognition and its heuristics even more by man's intuition. The day that a computer gets better at life and death than a 9p is not so far away. And even if its heuristics may never match man's intuition, it should at least theoretically be possible that its calculations prevail. The main point to me is: the day that computers surpass the level of a current 9p, man will probably not resemble what man is today.

4. Disagree. To me the game is all about the play.

5. A lot of my online games on KGS were handicap games. The problem is this: people including me, fairly soon start to care about their rating. This induces fear of losing and unwillingness to play. Games and particlarly online games should be seen as exercises, not as status challenges.

6. Disagree. In Go, the compensation of brute force with intuition is only temporary.

7. Agree, in the sense that Go has given me a valuable mindframe to make judgments in real life.

8. Every new stone should above all take the present stones and their possible develompment into account. Whether that means all territory, all influence or any percentage of aspects of profit, is secondary.

I always feel like I'm improving, though my results don't show it as much yet.

Do the results matter? If you fall into, as I do,RatingParanoia, then yes, when the ratings change game-to-game (or on IGS,day-to-day).

I am trying to not have the results matter.

2 june 2003

I can now get through the 8 kyu problems over at goproblems.com's Time Trial :). Now comes the small matter of seeing them in games. Got WinHonte...can only beat it on occasion on 9x9 with negative komi (i.e. WinHonte is White).

3 june 2003

Co-won a 9x9 rating tournament at LittleGolem.

5 june 2003

Not sure if I want to go back into the real-time servers yet or not, mainly because I doubt I'll ever be good enough of a player to play on an IGS,a KGS,or a NNGS.

16 june 2003

Haven't been able to get into Little Golem for a couple of days...:(.

Seems from what I can figure out, my biggest problem is choosing a good move in the centre.

19 june 2003

I can now get up into the 6 kyu problems at goproblems.com Time Trials, but can not yet do all of the 7k without a miss...

HolIgor: Interesting. I cannot do all 5k problems without a miss. And I am IGS 1k*, KGS 2d. I thought that if you can solve all 5k problems in your real game then you are at least a shodan. I belive that goproblems.com uses the old IGS ranks, so 7k is quite a decent level. Most problems are life and death or tesuji though. If you got them right you don't miss the opportunities in the games. A real game is different: it includes strategic points, balance of power and territory, development, speed and shape. There are not many problems on these topics.

One has to build positions first in which these opportunities would present themselves.

This is like the development of chess theory in 19th century. The old masters were masters of combinations, of great moves and deep reading. Then the players like Steinitz found out the great combinations occur much more often if your position was good. The way the chess players thought changed.

20 june 2003 Wanting my rating at Little Golem to go up badly,as it gets boring playing the same group of players over and over in the rating tournaments...but I suppose it's 2 out of 3 ain't good...

25 june 2003 Made a bad reading in agame over at Little Golem,will csost me about 25 points and the game.

2 july 2003 Been playing at KGS...first win tonight...was informed I was rude in not knowing when your opponent says slip it means undo. Shall I assume I never have to allow an undo,or are you required?

Hu: Nobody is required to grant an undo. On the other hand, if somebody makes a slip, or mis-click, or clicko, and immediately asks for an undo, it becomes easier to grant the undo. But it is still not required to grant it. In fact, it is rude to demand one if it has been refused.

12 july 2003 Made it to official 25K at KGS. Tonight played 2 games at 3 stones against Kado 22k. frst one was even until I blundered an invasion badly (thought a connection better than it was),and in the second game was by a very large margin (88.5 points).

15 july 2003 Up to 24K today at KGS. :)

Tim Brent/Go views last edited by TimBrent on July 13, 2003 - 23:08
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