Game 179

  Difficulty: Advanced   Keywords: Ongoing game

Two friends once discovered that they share the same passion (at a very sub-professional level, though). Now, decades later, living at a distance of some 1000km, they face each other again here to see how they have developed in the meantime...

mazze about 7k (german go club rating) chooses White.

Captured stones, no komi  



Concerning Komi: I would say we stay with our practice and do not consider Komi at all, agree?

Totally. That's how I understood the game.

Have you realized that B197 was a mistake? There, you can win at most one point (capture my stone) by investing 3 moves all of which are gote. At the same time you prevent me from making 1 point of territory which would have cost me sente. Preventing me from W198 (making territory in sente) would have been a little bit bigger. Not much, but I've warned you, the outcome will be close ;-)

(1) if Ba then Wb

(2a) if Ba Wb Bc then Wd

(2b) if Ba Wb Bd then Wc


Oh jeh! Back again after a long period of GO abstinence. Quite some stories to tell. Most important: i am playing at my favourite Restaurant (open air) on a beautiful beach with a little Jazz combo, you should come and see/listen! Its so much fun! Anyway, lets try to finish this game, i want to start all over again to put the things I learned into practice ;-)

I have some stories, too. We were in south Burgund (wonderful), I continued with New Orleans (still good Music) and Montreal. And now I know who wins the champaign (Ostseewette, I must not tell more details publicly, even the parents don't know yet). Not me, unfortunately. What was your guess? Anyway, now you have to cope with 182 (if 'a' then 'b').


Hmmm, as time goes by, the big event is no secret anymore: Dirk and Juliane will be marrying this friday! (you will have heard in the meantime, I guess)


How often do you happen to be online? We should make an appointment, however, I don't have time until next week...

On Monday we are flying to Lappland (with Tilman, Rike, Andreas Köbele und Richie), so I guess we have to wait another 3 weeks to finish the game (oh man, the outcome will be so close!).

if W 'a' then B 'b'. Wie wars in Lappland? Rike und Til haben schon einighes erzaehlt, Landschaft, Landschaft, Landschaft... Bin wieder online, habe ein kleines Problem gelöst. Meldet Euch mal wieder telefonisch. Gruss Micha

if B 'a' then W 'b'. (auf Wiederhören!) BTW.: What was our komi? Did we have any at all? Someone edited the stones to 6 1/2 komi. We have not agreed explicitely about this so far. Please tell me how you understood my offer that you start (komi or not), it will affect my tactics by about the next move!


again: If B'a', then W'b'

I guess the outcome will be close to 0,5 points...

W176: Greetings from Kathrin! An endgame hint: you could have counterattacked at W176, too, instead of defending your territory. Now I'm 1.5 points ahead... (just showing off, I'm still bad at counting). Today we are playing jazz again. All of us will be present! BTW: My chances of winning the "bet" are rising (if you know what I mean)...

...back from jazz. Greetings from the rest, too!

Greetings back, had 2 busy weeks with our top management visiting. Have to recover now... last week i went wind surfing, good wind we had! this year the power jibe will be possible. next week i am ofdf to Paris for training (unfortunately not Go). Say hi to Kathrin.

If B'a' then W'b'... d'accord?


Micha, if you play 'a', you can set my answer to 'b'

Back to your question: The problem with a ThankYouMove is that beginners tend to think: "I get this move for free since it is sente". However the question should be: "which stone makes more sense: my stone (often a weak stone) or my enemies stone (a necessary stone according to the definition of a ThankYouMove)?". In the endgame it is hard to find a thank you move since all stones make good sense. The question is just: in which order should I play them...

again: if B'a', then W'b'


Would you consider B139 a thank you move?

The concept of "thank you moves" doesn't make too much sense in the endgame. But what could I possibly teach you? You are quite a few points ahead... I think ...

Including your captured stones, I`d say you are 15 points ahead...last move for me, got to go to bed

Hmmm 15 points? Sounds good, but I'm not sure (I'd rather estimate some 10 points for you). However your last move helped me a bit (F10 is bigger than E15). Good night!



See you in 15 minutes! (How's your new piano?)

B144 (struggling, to get out of this with sente, too)


Hi, I must admit that in your absence I've been tempted to change my mind... initially I have played 'a', so if you want, you can set B124 to 'a'. If you want to go the harder way, think of a good answer to B124 (the move you must have expected). Just to speed things up: if you play H12 (after B124), I'll respond with K12 (you can edit it yourself).

Thank you... I hope you will not regret ... B128


116 Let the mess begin...

117 Sorry for the long interrupton, had some busy weeks and just lately founded a new band. We are playing once a week in a local restaurant, very decent place.

118 Hi! glad your back. What instruments are in your new bands? What tunes are you playing? No problem with the interruption - gave me time for lot's of analysis and malignant plans. Seems I have to rely on some mistakes from you to win this party...

ts, b, p, voc, real book stuff, Sting, ... just about to get a programme together


IzmirMicha: Just got home from salsa, brain not too fresh (heavy perfumes), but B101 should..., shouldn't it?

mazze it should...

IzmirMicha: Gote, however, and there are sooo many other urgent moves on the board... Mazze, I will be in Germany 09.-16.02., any time for a live game?

mazze I'll be in Leipzig that week, but not all the time. Let's see, maybe we can arrange something!


Greetings from Kathrin, she wants this game to happen in Tübingen ;-) and she wants the latest estimates of probability whether we can be in Capadocia with you in June...

Hi again! We are just thinking about sailing and getting more and more excited about it... Just to be sure: (first question from Kathrin) How many women are there...?

Plenty! Her, Kathrin, your wife, my friend, her parents daughter = total 5 women

These five women are just undergoing a democratic process... Some of them are sincerely concerned with your numbers and want to know nothing but the truth...

OK, lately I have been gaining some kilos, my numbers are now 90-70-90 ;-) with her they will be 3 ladies at the moment

Micha, I'm even worse with multitasking than I thought... I'm setting up some lamps, discussing the holiday with Kathrin and thinking about our go-game and want to be ready for cinema in one hour... I'd suggest we telephone in 5 minutes and play another day! (yes it hurts to stop)


mazze The fate is turning! W88 was just a little overplay and now you move forward without any grace! I really don't know if W92 works, I wish I could read the mind of those kibitzing...

"frösche Loft"!

"Des isch mei Luft!" (Warse amol)

IzmirMicha: Here's another Go proverb: "Life and death before morning eight, you'll definitely be for business late"

mazze: ;-) ... W96 I hope for a mistake of yours, otherwise I'll be lost

mazze: One more proverb (BTW how's your business?): there's death in the hane. You had the choice between two hane moves. I think the one you chose gives me ... well ... let's see. W98

IzmirMicha: There is nothing wrong with that proverb, as far as I can see :-) By the way, it was an elb...

mazze W100 still not giving up


Another remark on the upper side: If you have foreseen me taking a big bite out of it, you could have given up M14 and play to K16 instead...

In the beginning of June there are our "Pfingstferien". We could probably visit you then... (However, Tilman told me he already has planned to visit you this summer but forgot to arrange the details with you in Ursheim for some reason...)

I will call Tilman next week, but maybe you can arrange your individual schedules already during rehearsal

B83: I guess keeping contact with E13 is more valuable than reacting directly to W82. The white influence in the middle is dramatic.

mazze: I will not comment. I have some plans...

IzmirMicha: Now it's out in the public! You have a plan! I knew it, oh, I knew it. And all that time I think he's just playing randomly ;-)) B87 is totally passive, but not reacting...?

mazze: W88: I feel so much better with this. You could have played there in sente!

but not playing B87 would have led to a doubtful future in the upper left corner. We will see...

Micha, don't take my comments too serious. I'm just wondering why the game is looking so good for me. That encourages me to comment around. That doesn't mean that I could have done better against myself ;-)

71-80 Captured: 1 white stone, 1 black  

IzmirMicha You've got some nice influence in the center...

mazze you see why I didn't worry about eyes on the middle right...

IzmirMicha "Welch vorausschauender Mann Ihr doch seid, Aragorn" (who said that?)

mazze I won't sleep until I find out... W76

IzmirMicha Mazze, this is so much fun, but I have to go to bed. Good night to the 2 of u

mazze good night, I hope to see U soon!

... was it an elb or a man?

I analyzed the situation once again - can you tell me: why didn't you play "a" in the pre-previous diagram (the former W60)? Haven't you seen it or did you have a reason? It would have made life much more difficult for me!

IzmirMicha: Hi, I am back, even though the sun is shining, and I am tempted to ride my bike in the birds paradise nearby. To answer your question:I thought about K13, it would have kept the pressure on your groups by separating them. however, the upper middle is not secure at all, so I expected your upper group to live at the border, taking away a big bite out of my mojo, and your lower right group to put pressure on my right side (which was not very stable), getting good influence in the middle. As M15 neatly secures area on the upper right, and as the marked stone on E13 still gazes into your prospective territory in the middle, i considered M15 to be in favour of K13.

mazze Welcome back! I hope you still have the chance to ride to the birds... Just a few thoughts about your strategy: don't give up too early! OK, your territory at the upper middle is not secured. But neither was my life there. Just keep me under pressure and let your territory happen "en passant"...

mazze I was afraid of you playing "a" ...

This is going to be a mess, I knew that the weakness of my lost souls would cost me sooner or later...

W64 you have predicted this one, haven't you?

B65 Not at all!

W66 So you were surprised by W66, too?

Not as much as I am realizing the shortage of air ...

Come on, ye old scuba fellow ;-)



IzmirMicha B53 lots of preparative moves for that answer, but all in Sente

Autsch that hurts ;-)

mazze B56 let's fight!

B57 thats gonna be an interesting one :-)

Yep! Already read out the ladder(s)...?

Oh yes :-))! I was tempted shortly to play a, but B59 tightly secures valuable area, and the ladder is still gote...


with W34 and W40 I missed the biggest points and you proved me...

(another aspect of W37 verus 31: K-4 was much weaker and gained more from being attacked)

Mazze, how do you check whether I have made my next move? Recent changes games or do you reopen the game179 or do you stay in the edit page mode all the time?

mazze W44. No I reopen the page, otherwise I would block you... (unfortunately I was just mentally blocked with 2 phone calls) 13:30 finally I'll have to prepare me for the music, so 10 minutes left...

B45: L15 was definitely big, but isn't the white group on the middle right still too weak to be left alone already? What about an eye making move at a?

W46: Making eye shape in the middle is slow. I might should have cared about my base earlier (two stones on the third line usually are enough for two eyes - compare that with the middle!). But as long as I can get into fresh air (W46), I don't worry too much about my eyes. And W44 made the air even fresher... I have to leave now, see you this evening!

IzmirMicha Welcome back, how was the gig?

mazze Hi! I was playing spontaneous intermezzi to various recitations (theme: "Weiber!"). Small gig but fun!


mazze W2: Micha, I think B1 was another mistake, since it was a ThankYouMove. I need to strengthen K-4 in the view of your new wall anyway... If you are worried about eye shape, well ... you might have been correct (what do I know)

IzmirMicha I just read the chapter "play away from strength"... I think in this game I am violating all the rules to recall them and to have them ready for the next game ;-)

mazze W4: maybe too small but makes me feel a lot better. Kathrin tells me to tell you that she thinks we are crazy ;-)

IzmirMicha Finally somebody tells us! Did you already tell her that we will continue tonight after 20:00h??

mazze Brilliant! Izmir time or Tübingen time? W6

IzmirMicha Was B7 also a ThankYouMove? Tübingen mean time!

mazze No, B7 was worth a lot of points. It serves two purposes: it defends the corner and attacks me.

Moves 21-30

B1 IzmirMicha: The white double wing formation needs some action. However, is that the biggest play...?

mazze Those who know won't tell unless we explicitly invite them to comment. I just know that the 5-5 point is an unusual attack to the 4-4 point. I have exactly two "natural" continuations. It maybe worth thinking quite a while, but I don't have the patience... W2

Lets do Sunday 12:00 - 14:00 my time. Perhaps we can even start a second game

OK. C U then!

mazze just a comment on black21: instead of B21, a, b, c or d would have been much more common. I think B21 was less than ideal just for a simple reason: it is too close. I am one stone ahead of you in the corner, so in case of a close fight, I might control you more than you control me! There is a proverb about that, but I don't remember...

IzmirMicha I thought about that, but to gain the corner and let white establish an outer wall which makes my "wall" on the middle right rather useless seemed not attractive.

Charles Matthews You might want to look at angle play.

mazze Ill try to convince you that your choice isn't better ;-) Sorry to say that: You don't really have a wall on the middle right... you have influence on the center, but nothing there that promises big territory so far. After all, if you want to make an extension from thickness, you still want to stay away from your opponent. (I don't think this applies to that situation, it is more common at the side). For our level it is reasonable to stick to that order: (1) territory in the corner (2) territory at the side (3) territory in the middle. If we play for influence, it should be more promising. K-4 greatly reduces the value of your new shere of influence on the lower left.

Charles, thank you for your comment! This is not a classical teaching game, but we both are eager to learn!

IzmirMicha You are right, whilst white is building territory on the left, my shape looks overcrowded and not very effective

mazze Hi, geetings from Kathrin. Here is W28

Good morning and greetings back.


Moves 11-20

B1, micha an extension to the lower right side would have kept me out of trouble

W2, B3, W4 mazze maybe it's me who is in trouble... too lazy too read out but in a fighty mood ;-)

B5, W6 (there is some fresh air over there) Now W2 doesn't look like a satisfactory outcome from a shoulder hit. Maybe I've done something wrong...

B7, well, the small black group is still squeezed in and the 4 Black stones don't seem to be efficient at all

W8, you have room for eyes, access to the middle and keep my stones above under pressure... At least W8 is now sente (well, sort of, I hope not too many peope are reading my comments)


Moves 1-10

B1, W2, B3, W4, B5

W6 Let's See if we can learn from PlaysAgainstLowChineseOpening

B7, W8 (as described there...)

B9, W10 (now we have to think for ourselves...)

sunday teatime show down moves 1-10  

Game 179 last edited by on January 27, 2015 - 05:28
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