BQM 208

    Keywords: Question
Starting game position  

IlyaM: This is position from my last game. I'm playing white. I considered that it is a time to enter black's area in the lower right corner and played white+circle. Black responded with black+circle and we played sequence showed in the diagram (actually B10 was played at 'b' what is obviously an overplay but this is out of the scope of my question).

Sequence similar to pincer joseki which doesn't seem to work here  

My first question is about B4. I was expecting it at 'a' like in 44PointOneSpaceLowPincerInvasionInterception joseki. When my opponent played B4 I thought initially that it is an overplay so I was looking for refutation but I could't find any. If I'm reading correctly even if I had all ladders in my favor playing W5 at W7 in the initial diagram and then cutting at 'a' if black responds at W5 doesn't work. After game I've checked game databases and found that pros play B4 in the initial diagram both at B4 and at 'a'. Why and then they choose one of these points?

Direct 3-3 invasion compared to game result.  

My second question is about the difference between the result in my game and a direct 3-3 invasion. To my eyes the results are quite similar with the exception that White exchanged white+circle with black+circle? Wouldn't it better for white if I just invided directly at san-san?\

Dave: I think that there is still significant aji left in the White approach stone. It starts with the typical descent at W1 and can help White reduce or invade the area in front of Black's wall. dnerra: I agree 100%. The marked exchange is a clear gain for White.

Aji remains for White  

Dave: In this game the aji combines with the open right side to give White a lot of opportunities to follow up with plays around the points marked a

Block on the opposite side  

Dave: More importantly in this position, if White invades directly, Black will probably block on the wider side. The result (assuming this joseki results) is better for Black than in the game IMHO.

Double hane OK.  

W8 connects.

ThaddeusOlczyk: First the double hane is perfectly fine. Blacks wall works well with Blacks moyo.

dnerra: But White will play W6 at B7, since the cut on the right of B1 is not threatening anything. Then the Black stones along the lower side have lost much of their effect.

IlyaM: Exactly, it is actually happend in the game a bit later.

Done correctly Black can painfully demonstrate that there is more territory in the center than the sides.


Second in variations where B1 is played at a, it is because of the shortage of liberties in Blacks position created by the cut at a. The circled stone protects against the cut.

BQM 208 last edited by Dieter on July 5, 2008 - 12:48
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