Black/ Discussion

• normally follows a weaker order than White

Dieter: I don't understand this.

ProtoDeuteric: I personified black, comparing him to soldiers following a general's orders

• may be advised to resign if either it or White controls all four corners

Dieter: This is a very controversial statement, probably to be moved to proverbs arcana?.

ProtoDeuteric: I am aware of this. I decided to put it in as a "fun fact."

SomeoneWithNoWikiName: It may be funny (though I wouldn't call it fact), but a beginner who doesn't know proverbs is not going to get it. Someone new to the game might even think it's an actual rule. I'd suggest removing, or at least prefixing with "According to a proverb" or something similar...

Funny? I think that whoever first said it meant it to be funny because it's a stupid thing to say... When people are generalised it's racism, so why generalise games?! In my opinion nobody should teach this nonesense to anybody... Reuven

ProtoDeuteric: We have obviously come to a consensus and a conclusion that my original statement should be removed from the page because the reason that I put it on the page is inappropriate with respect to the intent of the page as a whole, so I now ask that we change or remove the disputed statement to better suit the rest of the page. I appreciate the arguments that have been made up to this point, but I don't think that we need to create any further arguments.

• (Hicham): ProtoDeuteric, I think there is a difference in view here on what pages should contain for information. Most of us would want it to contain only "serious" information, unless it is a discussion or a humour page. You page seems not very serious and (at least to me) not very funny. So, that is why this page is so harshly criticised. A lot of us [1] just don't see the point of this page. Is it intended for beginners? Is it some kind of joke? (ok, for me, but then just put it in the humour category.) What is the added value of these pages?
  • (Hicham) Ok, I might have been a bit too hard on this page. It has improved a lot since the beginning. I should have more faith it the community I guess ;)
  • ProtoDeuteric: I will humbly assume that my just previous comment and statement was misunderstood due to my lack of coherence. Let me try to restate my previous statement in a more coherent manner. I had already conceded that my original bulletpoint about black's "necessity" to resign should all four corners be controlled by the same color was unwisely included into the page and I continued by saying that it was my belief that the aforementioned bulletpoint should be removed because of the controversy (dare I say, aji keshi (further parenthetical phrase: I know that the way I used "aji keshi" was not completely correct, but it provided the humor to my argument necessary for me to procede with logic instead of anger)?) associated with it. In my attempt to make the page as thorough and complete as I could possibly make it, I overextended myself and included not a hard fact about black, but rather a controversial proverb (inserted with a slight humorous note) to "beef up" the content of the page. The reason that the statement was unwise as an addition to the page was that I had not considered the possible audience that would make use of the page, and, as such, I am sorry for the bulletpoint that sparked a relatively heated discussion page. Hopefully I have made my argument more coherent the second time around, and hopefully those who read my argument can now act on it instead of adding more arguments and content to this page.

Dieter: I like this page so much that I have contributed to it.

• the challenge is to add new information: a phrase such as "Between 6mm and 10mm thick according to another page on SL" is suspect, because there is potential for becoming outdated, so maybe this should be avoided?
• if this page would be pointless, there might be more pages on SL that deserve this qualification. Maybe we should add this category? :-) IMHO, this page will need a lot of effort to stay away from the humour zone and have useful, non-trivial content. The temptation to link every occurrence of "black" or "white" is, however, most probably overkill.
• ^[1] sure about that? ;-)

--axd

• Proto, don't worry about those earlier comments. An entire page devoted just to Black? Of course its tounge in cheek or dry humor to some extent. This isn't the Encylcopedia Brittanica. It's a great page! I'll even bet its possible to have humor and real information on the same page.

• ProtoDeuteric: Thanks. I really appreciate the encouragement. However, this page was not created with my tongue in cheek or dry humor at all. What triggerred my creation of this page arose from the realization that even though the idea of two colors of stones is so fundamental to the game of Go, those two colors had absolutely no home to call their own. I was shocked by this, especially because there were plenty of pages dedicated to concepts that were so far on the fringes of the theory of Go, so I decided to act for a change. Looking back, and knowing myself, I am suprised that I didn't complain instead (but that is said with tongue in cheek).