Forum for Active superko

Active SuperKo: Has it been Analyzed for weaknesses? [#852]

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Flower: Active SuperKo: Has it been Analyzed for weaknesses? (2007-01-23 09:36) [#3004]

I find your Active Superko rules quite intriguing. As far as I can see it is roughly equivalent to a permissive Natural Situational Superko. But at the same time it is worded in a simpler way and is trying to evade a negative definition by forbidding moves.

Unfortunately my skill level is quite abysmal so I could not judge the consequences in more problematic Ko-Situations.

Have other players analyzed it for weaknesses? Or have you found any yourself? (I am missing it in Robert Jasiek's Ko-Comparison site for example :)

blubb: Re: Active SuperKo: Has it been Analyzed for weaknesses? (2007-01-24 23:32) [#3007]

A major practical weakness is that, to achieve the state of "no threats left", all territory but essential eyes has to be filled, which usually takes many boring moves.

Concerning the naming, I am not satisfied with it, either. "Active SK" is meant to indicate that the winner wins actively, due to a winning move. That's certainly a bit far-fetched. More sensible candidates are e. g. "positive SK" or "permissive SK", but unfortunately, both start with "P" and hence would be abbreviated misleadingly as "PSK".

tderz: ((no subject)) (2007-01-23 14:01) [#3005]

I was wondering why (in the given example), Black also had to commit a move which repeats the game-position, thus also illegal(?) to claim his win.

This could come into conflict with (Lightning) Tournament Rules, where the first one to notice & claim (an illegal move or) a fallen flag could (call the TD and) claim the win, independent whether your flag has fallen too.

To me this ko rule called active superko is purely academical, until now I do not understand its added value over the basic superko rule (The superko rule simply states that any repetition of a previous situation is disallowed.), let alone any practical importance in real games between humans. tderz

blubb: Re: ((no subject)) (2007-01-23 22:02) [#3006]

Sorry, I can't quite follow. It seems to me that you are mixing up superko variants. By "the" superko rule, you're probably referring to positional superko (PSK). Under active superko though, it is not illegal to repeat a position (in fact, no move at any empty point is illegal).

In practical play, active superko often behaves like situational superko (SSK). However, with no threats for either side, the example position above is seki under both PSK and SSK, whilst it is completely White under active superko.

tderz: Re: ((no subject)) (2007-01-23 22:09) [#3008]

Well, I see and resign to understand at this point.
It will be of relevance for analyzing theroretical rules of Go.
PSK seems to be my natural understanding of ko.

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