CharlesMatthews: Regarding: Yahoo (2005-10-12 18:20) [#129]

Barthoze: There are lots of things wrong with "Yahoo! Go" Server.

I will agree with all of the above. I get stuck playing on yahoo every now and then when i cant get kiseido to work on the computer i am using. by the end of my game, i normally have thoughts of quiting go all together. but i collect myself and go out to the chat area and plead with others to try go on other sites. its so much better. now when i cant get to kiseido, i jump on dragongoserver.

1. First, the rating system, that looks like the Elo rating for chess players, sorry, but that's just not Go.
2. Second, the clock has only one option : just one amount of time at the beginning and no byo-yomi, plus the stupid pass rules that makes some games crash into mind-crippling, annoying no pass go, what is considered as "cheating".
3. Insufficient (if not completely lacking) replaying or saving abilities, which disallows many teaching possibilities.
4. Too many players are horribily rude over there. KGS or IGS aren't completely jerk-free either, but "Yahoo!" seems to lure more of them.

I've moved to IGS now, and I won't go back there.

The "stupid passing rules" are as follows: after two passes, players select which stones are dead, and then a prompt comes up to ask whether the players agree that the game is over. (Assumably to prevent people from marking undead stones as dead to cheat.) If the the players do not agree that the game is over, the game continues, and passing is forbidden for the first player at this point.

This means that in many situations a player can force his opponent to, effectively, never pass. (By cancelling out the pass by passing and then not ending the game.)

Funkybside: Yes but I'll give yahoo credit for one thing; Had it not been for how horribly bad yahoo go is, I would have never found IGS. For that, I am greatful!

Yahoo does have a wide appeal. It certainly gets people interested. I used to be an avid backgammon player. One night, tired of backgammon, i tried out go. I haven't gone back.

Artis: Not just "not ending the game", but possibly letting your (frustrated) oponent to run out of time. Someone pulled this on me once. I asked him why he did it -- he said he wanted to win...

Malweth: Yahoo does have its good points. Most games are even and you never know your opponent's strength (true, this is a side effect of the bad ELO system). This gives you more versatility in playing players with different strengths. Furthermore, at the approx 8k level you have about an equal chance of playing a weaker player as you do someone stronger. Playing someone stronger while thinking that they may be equal to you is a good way to get stronger yourself. It's also interesting to note that you can play go on Yahoo Japan - but unless you read Japanese it isn't easy trying to figure out how to make an account.

cameron:I will agree with all of the above. I get stuck playing on yahoo every now and then when i cant get kiseido to work on the computer i am using. by the end of my game, i normally have thoughts of quitting go altogether. but i collect myself and go out to the chat area and plead with others to try go on other sites. its so much better. now when i cant get to kiseido, I jump on dragongoserver.

SGBailey: Another problem is that it appears that your opponent can change the game conditions between the time you click 'Start Game' and the time he clicks it. Several times now I've been expecting to play a 10_minutes_per_move even game only to discover it has become a 4 stone (I was white) 5 miniute timed game. Unless your opponent agrees to cancel you are stuck.

SGBailey: Also the Yahoo Help is hopeless - It explains all about how to play Go (which I know) and nothing about the Yahoo interface which is all trial_and_error. (I still play 9*9 at the occasional lunchtime though...)