Forum for Page of the month
Edit wars, and so on... (some explanations) [#259]
Seems many people complaining about edit wars occured recently, and blaiming breakfast for this. Before reading any futher, please read breakfast's info, it can clarify something .
Tension against russian federations has long history. But on SL our federation never did anything destructive. Recently, many pages of members of our federation (much of them were created or maintained by breakfast) were edited, links to photos were changed, and information were mispresented. Breakfast reverted changes, and everything repeated again. See ![[ext]](images/extlink.gif)
here for reference. Those edits were considered as vandalism by administration.
And now, I'm interested, how breakfast is related to "edit wars" and, more important, how "edit wars" are related to Go in extreme places?
Our opponents did exactly same things earlier (provoking and then blaming us) on russian forums. IMHO, their goal is to discredit our members/federation.
I'm more interested in the facts, which could represent an improvement in Sensei's Library's coverage.
It is my understanding that Igor Grishin's organization is by far the smaller; why was it created? Why can it not function within the other, which seems to be the one that has international recognition?
Perhaps an NPOV treatment of this question would be a better place to spend time.
Can you explain/link, what is "NPOV"?
I do not think that it is "by far" the smaller. There was 173 members of RGF, and our federation had 63 members in 2005 (considering much greater fee). And, our federation is much newer. Old federation is very burocratic, not transparent and last years go stagnated in Russia. There was almost no new players, and old players (some of them has nearly 30 year of go expirience) continued to play each other (often at very good level), but there was no "fresh blood". Igor, who was already running his club and teaching people, asked for help from federation, but federation rulers denied to give him any power. Much go players in Russia are very inertial, and far from any "politics". Then, new federation was created (in 2003, as I recall). Some entusiast grouped around Igor to support new federation. Our federation has international contacts (China, Ukraine, Japan, Korea), but most of them are "unofficial".
IMHO, Igor alone did for Russian go more than whole "old" federation together for last years.
As I think, some "old" player are envious for Igor's success in go popularisation, and some of them disagree with him about methods. I contacted with members of both federations, and I prefer "new" one.
Press release about our federation.
I'm delighted if he's getting people to play the game and building interest.
I don't understand why you have to have power to do that.
Power (I mean administrative power) worth something. Without organization you cannot run tournaments, find sponsors, publish books and newspapers, etc.
Why? I don't have to have any power in the AGA to organize a contest, publish books, and so forth.
One might not need power for those tasks, but definitely power is useful. Sometimes, people lacking power come out with good proposals (and willing to act on it) only to get shot down by those who have power in the organization. You figure the rest...
At least, you have working federation. It makes difference. And, organizations attracts people, helps international contacts, etc., etc. I think, power is needed at some point, it helps to develop go in country.
I think what is disappointing is what look like inflated ranks, combined with a focus on power rather than playing the game.
Who cares who has power? You say that people are "envious"; what does that mean? How does it manifest itself?
Incidentally, the continued labelling of the play of go-moku as go surely doesn't lend credibility!
By "power" I mean administrative power, not game strength. About rank issue: most members of our federation stopped plaing in rating tournaments of "other" federation. So, ranks was not uptdated for 2-3 years. If you interested in game strength estimation, ask breakfast, who is strongest go player in Europe. Also, Igor has diploma, mentioned by breakfast.
Anyway, editing other person's claimed ranks looks like at least impolite.
I knew that's what you meant by power; what I don't understand is why you have to run the organization to do those things.
It sounds more like some people wanted to do cool stuff AND they wanted power, so they are engaged in a power struggle. This is only bad for go.
It also hurts that they have chosen a name very similar to the old name. Why not choose an obviously different name, instead of one that is subtly different and easily confused?
Incidentally, the continued labelling of the play of go-moku as go surely doesn't lend credibility!
breakfast was not the one, who claimed it "Go". He just took it from http://www.czech-go.net/photos/misc/extreme/ext.php
There is note on the page by DrStraw about gomoku-looking position. Anyway, it's extreme, is it go or gomoku.
According to the official page at http://www.european-go.org/www/count.htm , Russian Go Federation has 95 members, uncluding 40 junious players. Go Federation has 63 members and all of them are older than 18. So, which federation is bigger?
NPOV = Neutral point of view ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NPOV)
NPOV violations:
The neutral point of view is a difficult policy for many of us to understand, and even Wikipedia veterans occasionally accidentally introduce material which is non-ideal from an NPOV perspective. Indeed, we are all blinded by our beliefs to a greater or lesser extent. While regrettable, this is not vandalism.
To be honest, I don't really care either way about this. The likelihood that any of this would ever affect me outside of SL is quite small. There's just vague annoyance at the constant chest thumping in response to the few admittedly childish and petty vandalism attacks. The reason this got dragged into the page of the month was because the nominated page looks like part of that same chest thumping for the most part.
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