# Elo Rating/ Discussion

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As a chess player (1800-1900) I find these arguments[1], especially on a Go page, somewhat biased. However I also play Go (just attained 14 kyu). Personally I feel the games, depth-wise, are equal. Or nearly so, I do acknowledge that there is going to be a difference in depth although this difference is infintesimal to a human. Unless you are speaking in some mathmatical terms which I probably, am ignorant of. The draw will throw people off who are advocates of Go. Likewise the protracted[2] nature of Go will similarly confuse Chess players, which I believe is the reason you see high win ratios amongst people of only one rank difference in Go (the sum of accumulated advantages is different these games). That's what I think anyway.

I think it is inherent that in a discussion about a comparision (depth of Go vs. Chess), the resp. arguments itself are biased (although, perhaps I do not fully understand the meaning of that word). I think the order could be:

Subjective - biased - pre-disposed, pre-judiced.
I think it is nothing wrong with being subjective, I even like people who know where they stand and take a (consequent & consistent) position. Instant dogmaticians (Germ.: Augenblicksdogmatiker) are differentiated by the word consistent.

### Difference between facts and opinions:

A fact cannot be biased:

In example if I had the two (true) arguments

• Go is deeper (than Chess) - and it was a fact supported by more levels of standard deviations of winning probabilities (from beginner to best player as elaborated on the referring page);
• Chess is wider (than Go) - whatever that would mean here, just take as example and suppose it was a fact too,

then just stating the (carefully selected) facts seems not pre-disposition to me (ok, spin doctors will smilingly disagree).

However any deriving conclusion from there in style of "M is better than N, because of A" or even "because of A and B" can easily be biased, because the conclusion better is an opinion.

That is the difference between facts and opinions.

(Quote: "The problems with opinions is - that everyone has one.")

tderz: [2] Do you mean Go is protracted in the sense of a lengthy game? In average most Chess games have about 40 double moves, whereas Go has about 120 double moves.

(I honestly do not know) Do you think that (apart from Blitz etc.) Go games take 3 times longer? Will chess player not like Go because they had to play 3 times more moves, play longer or why would they be confused?

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Elo Rating/ Discussion last edited by tderz on March 14, 2005 - 12:04