rank - on go servers

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Hu of KGS: For a long time IGS was three ranks out of whack (away from equivalence) compared to all almost all other ranking schemes. I think it was the third quarter of 2002 that they were adjusted.

KGS ranks are held close to AGA ranks by use of anchors, but it would be good to put KGS into the table[1]. While you are at it, move the misplaced "Suggested Equivalences" to a title where it belongs so that the whole table can be moved to the left margin.

Tobias Klaus?: IGS rating (at least in the single digit kyu and dan area) is a pretty exact match to the european rating right now. I readjusted the IGS numbers for that[1].


Harpreet: It seems the chart above did not reflect the IGS +3 inflation. So I adjusted the numbers for that.


Harpreet: Well, the chart is no good, it seems. I adjusted the ranks up for IGS inflation but if it's wrong relative to European ratings then it was wrong before as well. Now IGS is wrong relative to AGA (should be about the same). So perhaps this thing was fiction from the start.


Alberto Rezza: This is another try. Still very approximate, of course, but perhaps nearer to the truth. Any comments?

3Gup (Kor) = 1K (Chi) = 1D (IGS, KGS) = 2D (Eur, NNGS) = 3D (AGA) = 4D (Jap)

The European/NNGS rank seems to be best, in the sense that, always keeping a difference of one handicap stone between amateur ranks, an amateur 9D would be just as strong as a pro 9D. In this way the amateur and professional rankings would be actually the same, joining at the top and varying only in the strength difference per rank.

Dieter: Just to give some material to underline that online go requires other skills than face to face go: on KGS I met two members of the BGF against whom I have equal trouble to win in real life. They are 2D and 1D respectively in our rating system. I am in between at 1D. On KGS they are 4D and 1k respectively. I am in between at 2D. Those two players qualify KGS rating as generous and tough respectively ...

[1] Sebastian: What table are you guys talking about? And how do rank inflations happen? -- 2003-09-10

Sebastian, the table is at Rank Worldwide Comparison--TimBrent


Funkybside: I must disagree with the equivilence of IGS and KGS ranks mentioned above. While 14k* on IGS, I was happily playing a 6k* account on KGS. I only used the KGS account for a short time (maybe it's been corrected), but I did not notice much strength difference bewteen 8-6k* KGS players and 14-11k* IGS players.

ggleblanc: I agree with Funkybside. The high kyu ranks on IGS are almost twice as strong as the ranks on KGS. As of August 2004, I have a 13k account on KGS and a 25K account on IGS. Anyone weaker than 15K will not be able to maintain a ranking on IGS.

Someone moving from IGS to KGS unaware of the difference would set themselves up to sandbagging. Someone moving from KGS to IGS will lose a lot of games.

  • Just a couple of comments: double digits are usually referred to as low kyu, not high kyu; it is unlikley the KGS players will be accused of sandbagging as you cannot set a rank there - the server sets it based on results.

anonymous To add some data: I'm 5k on KGS and 10k+ on IGS.

erikpan A quick question - how do people think OGS compares (if anyone's on it)? I'm new to internet Go and just imnterested :)

xela: Someone has started putting numbers for OGS at Rank - worldwide comparison. It's still too early to get a clear picture (time moves more slowly on turn-based servers!), and there aren't many dan level players yet, but the ranks seem to be close to KGS ranks.

Jamal: I'm 3k on Kgs and 8k on IGS.

terrorist: I'm 5k kgs and 10k on IGS

Why do different go servers have different ranks? Wouldn't it be much easier if all servers had the same ranking system

erikpan: This is simply because of the way that the maths works. As different people join, their strengths will be evaluated with slight errors at the beginning which leads to everyone being slightly out a little bit; these errors will tend to increase slowly over time, partly due to the mathematical phenomenon in working out ranks called 'drift' (see wiki ([ext] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system) for more details) in which the range of ranks (or the average rank) in any group of players will tend to 'drift' in either direction (higher or lower) over the course of time; so that even if all ranks were standardised at a given point they'd be inaccurate again after a while. Remember, rank is only an approximate estimate of strength, taking many different kinds of ability into account in producing one single numerical estimate, so it's never going to be perfect :)

Some kind of server ranking system seems to be patented: [ext] European Patent EP1854521. No dates indicated.


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