Double hane example 1
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aLegendWai: A sgf file for this example is provided by me. It has more variations and comments. I hope it can illustrate better for all of the following.
Click on http://hk.geocities.com/wai_wai_sir/my_go_q/stop_en_run.zip to download.
To know how to open and view sgf file, see: http://hk.geocities.com/wai_wai_sir/htm_sub/frameset.htm (click on FAQ)
Black 3 is a powerful play as it shuts White into the corner. White cannot counter Black 3.
- mat But what about White a, Black b, White c? Ahhh I see (first think, then edit...): White captures 3 and Black captures the three white stones!
Black captures the marked stones and kills the corner as well. As Black 3 in the diagram above is such a powerful play, White has actually made a mistake before and should have extended to Black 1 above herself.
Add more examples if you feel like it :o) --ArnoHollosi
aLegendWai (9k? KGS): The above is just part of the story.
It depends on the situation.
If a ladder is favorable to B, playing at b will be observed.
Otherwise, a.
Even if the ladder is favorable to B, it doesn't mean W should not play in this way. is used as a threat to B. When a W ladder breaker occurs, B has to capture the W stone. Otherwise you should know what to do ^^
Scartol: Well, I tried to play through the possibilities for the following question, but because of my difficulty reading, I couldn't sort it out.
Suppose White plays at 1 here, instead of a. Can Black still kill the corner?
aLegendWai(9K? KGS): W should play at instead. Playing at 1 leaves B a chance to play useful atari.
W already live without .
Jan: I think the idea of the original double hane is not to kill White, but to prevent White from escaping. If Black omits 3 in the original diagram, White could later play 4 or a in the following one, for a substantial gain in territory. Your White 1 lets Black make a trumpet connection with very good thickness.
Hans: Depending on the white stones in the neighbourhood normally black should connect at a in the diagram above. Since the six white stones are very strong white cannot cut and white has only one point for playing a peep. Opinions?
aLegendWai(9K? KGS): It is my little opinion. Solid connection or trumpet connection is possible depending on whole-board situation.
The weakness at "a" occurs when W has a ladder breaker. Then 2 groups are separate. It doesn't automatically mean the solid connection is very wrong however. In my opinion, I think it is genereally better than the trumpet connection
zinger: If white cuts at a, black can capture this stone locally starting with b, unless white has some very well-placed stones on the next line up. So ladder breakers usually won't matter. (Later) Hmmm, on second thought maybe it's not quite so simple.
The weaknesses of peep at "a" and "b" can force B in lump shape. However it is not necessarily mean B must connect when there's a peep.
![[Diagram]](../../diagrams/8/a3e6f8fbc0616c1537a82177d42d4b35.png)
W's peep at A
If whole board situation favors, when W's peep at A, black may choose to play at for a trick play. And force W into confusing fight. At that time, B can keep W running and build another strong wall or influence
Note: The line of play may not be optimal. It is just to show you roughly about the idea.
![[Diagram]](../../diagrams/21/01f5a5f624fb615c6aae80bba6f347a1.png)
W's peep at B
If whole board situation favors, when W's peep at B, black may choose to play at D. Even if W cut at , B will treat
lightly and force W to capture it. A more horrendous wall is built.
However W is able to escape. But as I said previously, the whole-board situation may justify B to play like that (eg there're some B stones around before W peeps, so W can't really gain much from the escape).
Any comment is welcome.
Nat 15k, KGS?
![[Diagram]](../../diagrams/31/c60749dab405649e91f5850d8f2e57d5.png)
W's peep at 1
In the previous diagram, black can still play and either seperate the 2 groups, or kill the corner with
? So white cannot simply
, needs to do something about
?
unkx80: The basic instinct should point to .
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