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BQM 41
Path: BigQuestionMark · Prev: BQM40 · Next: BQM42
Keywords: Joseki, Question
ChessWhiz:
HolIgor: Let us see if Black did not punish himself already.
The purpose of
The question is now whether
In the usual joseki it is at a or b. In the latter case Black needs one more move to cap the white stone.
Now
It seems that a stone at a is placed more efficiently. Of course, if this is not the first corner, joseki interaction with other stones might change everyting. dnerra: Hmm, that got me interested. HolIgor, maybe Black would deviate from the second joseki as below?
Despite the two weaknesses in his wall (a and b), I'd think this is good for Black.
Of course, White might not co-operate, and then I will have a hard time showing that
I would start by claiming that I of course checked all ladders before playing
And the fight continues beyond the scope of both this diagram and this analysis :-)
Black could also play
To come back to the original question: It looks very natural for me to start with
Charles Cutting immediately at x is better for White. This is a case of the one-two-three principle.
Nando: I've never seen this move before, so I checked
To me, it looks like a more forceful move than the pincers a or b, and possibly making a better use of Black's wall in the bottom right.
White chose this sequence. For the record, Black won by more than ten points (the center moyo remained almost untouched, solidifying in a single huge territory).
I'd conclude that this move is playable under specific circumstances (looking at a couple other games with this pattern, I suspect that the plan is to emphasize an existing strength/influence on the side where the second stone is played and in the center).
(For those with access to Jansteen's site (not everyone?) the DaveSigaty: The Nihon Kiin's Igo Daijiten includes this move. The 1980 edition covers it with a total of 65(!) diagrams. A few of the key findings are shown below. This is a non-standard move in modern go but it is not a trick play. It is obviously outside oriented so if Black can get extra value from a wall facing along the right or toward the bottom, it can be a viable choice. It appears in older Chinese games dating back to at least the 12th century AD.
Pulling back at
The result to
However, Black is clearly thin and White is threatening to start something with White a, Black b, White c later.
If White switches to
When Black pushes at
Black can try moving
In the local situation White is better. However, as mentioned above, the original shoulder hit is usually based on the overall position so this may still work for Black.
This
Again however, Black is going to have to cede the corner to White so locally this is going to hurt.
Locally the question seems to be what happens after Black plays this combination of
The ladders toward the lower right need to favor Black but if they do, this can lead to some heavy fighting that favors Black at least as much as White.
Playing into the corner is considered uninteresting.
Black's outside influence is too great after
If
If
If ChessWhiz: Thank you, all, for your contributions. Path: BigQuestionMark · Prev: BQM40 · Next: BQM42 This is a copy of the living page "BQM 41" at Sensei's Library. ![]() |