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Seki with Eyes Question
Path: EyesCollection   · Prev: TheCodeSoFarEyes   · Next: GroupWithOnlyHalfEyes
    Keywords: Question, Rules

The explanation of Territory and Area Scoring is interesting, and I now think I almost understand the difference.

[Diagram]
Seki: area score diff. from terr. score?

A position similar to this cropped up in one of my recent games. (Except that the game wasn't close, and was decided by resignation, so we didn't have to try to figure this out.) In this example, there are no prisoners, and White played last (both players have put down the same number of stones). Neither Black nor White can approach on the right without putting themselves in atari, so it is seki.

White has an eye, and Black has an eye and a false eye... or is it really false, since White cannot approach the other end?

My impression is that this seki scores nothing for either player under Japanese rules (territory scoring), but that both players would get some points for the seki under Chinese rules and other using area scoring. Is this correct?

Ignoring the seki, White has 49 and Black has 48 (no komi, no prisoners). Accounting for the seki, what is the score under area scoring? What is the score under territory scoring?

Thanks, -- TakeNGive (11k)



It is clearly a seki because there is a dame that neither player wants to fill.

Under territory scoring the surrounded empty points in seki are not counted. White wins by 1.

SAS: You mean under Japanese rules (or Korean rules). There are other territory scoring rules (e.g., IGS rules) where points in seki do count.

Under area scoring the 3 surrounded empty points in seki are counted (2 for Black, 1 for White), and also the stones in seki (10 for Black, 10 for White). Therefore it is jigo.

TakeNGive interjects -- but there are not the same number of stones in seki, right? I count 12 for Black and 10 for White. Does this mean that Black wins by 2 under area scoring?

Oops, sorry. I shouldn't have subtracted the difference between stones not in seki to compare the number of stones.

Area count:
White stones (no dead nor captured stones): 34 (of which 10 are in seki).
White's surrounded empty points: 50 (of which 1 is in seki).
White has 34 + 50 = 84 points
Black stones (no dead nor captured stones): 34 (of which 12 are in seki).
Black's surrounded empty points: 50 (of which 2 are in seki).
Black has 34 + 50 = 84 points

Therefore it is jigo.

Ah, now it is clear. Thank you! - TakeNGive


Path: EyesCollection   · Prev: TheCodeSoFarEyes   · Next: GroupWithOnlyHalfEyes
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