![]() StartingPoints Referenced by
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BQM65
Difficulty: Advanced
Keywords: Opening
I've seen O Rissei play this quite a lot recently (including at present in the Kisei match):
I can see the logic of approaching at 3 immediately: it is, I suppose, in some sense a sort of miai strategy with respect to a and b (Black's getting a shot at two corners in any case, and he doesn't much mind which two - but it appears to me here that if he gets a, he's failing to approach on the open side, which seems a bit unusual. For what it's worth, Yamashita Keigo responded with a pincer at x.) Is this early approach really a sort of probe? My speculation is something along the lines of O Rissei wanting to transpose into a line of the mini-chinese or nirensei, but is it simply a matter of trying to avoid:
as if White has responded at B in the first diagram, leading to:
tenuki and taking 7 would appear to be justified, leading to quite a nice position for Black (with the low stone at 4, pincering 3 is presuably going to be easily dealable via the 3-3 invasion.) So, I guess what I'm asking, and apologies for this being somewhat nebulous, is what on earth is actually going on here?
Andrew Walkingshaw (4 kyu, UK)
Bill: I don't know what's going on, but I would be happy to play W 4, here.
As White, I would not be unhappy with this line of play. Charles Matthews Bill and Andrew both make reasonable points. This early approach has been played by pros for a decade: White 4 has been tried in 15 different places (!), and sometimes we get transposition to familiar positions such as mini-chinese, sometimes novel situations arise. Could just be that the flexibility of the 4-4 point is being invoked before Black plays a 3-4 point which gives the game a more specific character. See fuseki not taking free corners for some general comments. dnerra: I find it very hard to tell what is going on in such situations. My impression is that this is not so much a battle about objective advantages, but about trying to get to your favourite fuseki, or avoid the opponent's favourite one. So without knowing what the fuseki-preferences of the players involved, you don't know what they are trying to do.
Take for example Bill's diagram above. I think he likes it because if Black continues with the natural play at a, he has approached White 4 from the "wrong side". But then again, there are games where this is played voluntarily. Bill: I like it because, if Black plays next in the bottom right corner, White can combine extension with pincer. I do not see what compensation Black gets for allowing that.As White, I would not be unhappy with this line of play.
Amusingly, exactly what you Bill said you didn't like is what the pros transposed into: this position is exactly equivalent to a nirensei where Black has chosen not to approach on the open side, with White playing the expected pincer/extension combo. However, with 7, as it turns out, O Rissei got a sensible result along the bottom, to my eyes. No-one ever said this game was simple, I guess! (For what it's worth, after the pincer I'd have taken 6 with my third move as Black, followed (if White took 5) by invading at 3-3. Is this a sensible way of dealing with that hypothetical position?
Without a white stone in the vicinity of a, White 8 is usually considered the wrong side to block. If now Black b, White c, Black d to wedge, White's wall can't work efficiently. DaveSigaty: I think the first question that arises if White considers playing at the marked point is what happens if Black plays the double approach. Below is the experience for 1990 - July 2002 reported in GoGoD CD.
Bill: I vote for this one. :-)
Statistics:
18 matches (18/0), B: 83.3%, W: 16.7%
Wa: 10 (10), B70.0% - W30.0% The game list is interesting in light of the Kisei game...
1993-04-03d: Takemiya Masaki - Yang Hui (B), 5b The most usual reply for White 4 is the quiet knight's move. This falls in with Black's original intention but Black does not seem able to produce any advantage from this.
Statistics:
93 matches (93/0), B: 41.9%, W: 58.1%
Ba: 57 (57), B45.6% - W54.4% Yamashita does not figure in this line. O Rissei appears four times but ends up 0-4:
1997-08-11a: O Rissei - Kobayashi Koichi (B), 4a It makes you wonder why he likes it! :-) This is a copy of the living page "BQM65" at Sensei's Library. ![]() |