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Meta Discussion
Keywords: SL description
What do you like / don't like about Sensei's Library?
Write down your thoughts below.
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Discussions on the following topics have now a separate page:
DeletingPages 6 October 2001 - 09:38 GMT+1__ I second the request for a recompilation of Pages by Distance. With over a 1000 pages, some parts of the library must be pretty far from the entrance by now.
--Stefan
2001-10-03, 12:20 GMT+1 DieterVerhofstadt: I think the most important areas for improvement are still the number of contributors, the regularity of contributions and the number of high-level contributors. An increase in volume will then force some of us to restrict ourselves to the heavy task of master editing. Maybe some time in the future a user can choose between viewing the latest archived version (some kind of generally accepted master edit of the whole SL) and viewing and contributing to the latest version (which is the current practice). My wildest ideas include the master master team (Arno & Morten), the joseki master team, the life and death master team, etc, etc I know this is way off the original spirit of SL, but I think (as some of you probably do too) that the current practice suits only the RecentChangesJunkies. It would be interesting, for that matter, if Arno had the engine recompute PagesByDistance and MostPopular.
2001-10-03 We do indeed have a general problem (opportunity for improvement ;^) which is that the information within SL covers a very wide range, but is not always easily findable or browsable. For knowledgeable Go players there is more of an incentive to look more around, and they also often know what they're looking for, but for beginners, this is not often the case. Something like the beginners study section is a good idea, which will probably develop into something very useful to beginners over time. Morten has already come up with the idea of dynamically created HotTopics?, etc. I will implement them (maybe this weekend, but don't hold your breath). About the issue of not finding information in SL: well, create an index page of the topic you like, populate it with links to the relevant pages, and add your page to either StartingPoints, GuidedTours, ReferenceSection, or whichever other page seems suitable for it. I think wikis live from links, so the more index pages we have, the better. Maybe I'm trying to come up with a heuristic function to find "related pages". I don't know yet. Other wikis have some neat ideas for navigation. Or if you find a better format for the FrontPage, then go ahead and change it. --ArnoHollosi
2001-10-03 Stefan: Replying to HolIgor: You're right, it isn't complete. Probably never will be. Nor suitable for beginners. That's exactly my point! It should be, so let's make it more suitable for beginners. They are the visitors most likely to benefit from SL. They'll often not be a member of a club or federation, they won't have a lot of books or magazines, or indeed access to bookshops. And even if they see a list of books, they won't have a teacher or a clue what book to read first. And yet another argument: we currently have a wave of new talent in our club, and quite a few seem to have picked up go on the internet. So SL has a Responsibility towards the Global Go Community to "Hook" these Novices while there Wandering around, Thirsty for Information and Knowledge. (I love writing pompous sentences like that every once in a while...) Oh, and on the joseki thing: won't matter at all for beginners! :-)
2001-10-02 HolIgor: Replying to Stefan. While there is a bounty of interesting material in the library, it is not very suitable for beginners or a serious study. Material is scattered, sporadic and spontaneous. It is in the spirit of the library, though. Perhaps we need a guide to the library. Perhaps we need to look back at what has been done and then make a simple page for the beginners advising them what to look at.
But we have almost nothing on joseki, fuseki and yose. At least the material is not systemized in any way. Presentation of shapes and connections has only begun. We have a good section of questions and answers and a series of problems with solutions. Arno: on josekis we have AndreEngels's excellent study of the LargeAvalanche, NadareJoseki and others. I wouldn't call that almost nothing.
HolIgor: I did not want to play down Andre's contribution. The quality of those pages is very high. But the coverage of the topic is not sufficient at the moment.
2001-10-02 (copied from Messages...) I've spoken to some beginners who know this site, and they seemed too confused by the layout and organisation of SL to easily get to what they want. In general I think the average go player who comes here to look for something specific like, say, shape, will quickly find his way through ReferenceSection and the likes. But beginners typically "don't know what they don't know" and don't know where to start. To help meeting their needs I've added a direct shortcut to TeachingPaths very, very early, i.e. high on the FrontPage. I intend to link TeachingPaths to a lot of sections in the Library. Working through these pages, the beginners should then quickly be sufficiently familiar with SL to wander around more freely. Thoughts? Comments? Especially from beginners: do you comfortably find what you need here? --Stefan
August 25, 2001 BTW, I like the format of MessagesToPeopleCurrentlyPresentInTheLibrary the best with date stamps and newer items pushed onto the stack. Is that the better way to handle all these general discussion pages?
--DaveSigaty Big Trouble :-)I have done a WikiMasterEdit of this page and created OldMetadiscussion. The kind remarks are in MentioningGradesOrNot. So I hope I am only in a little trouble
Not everything is worth archiving, so it's not mandatory (but sometimes good) to move stuff to "OldXXX". OTOH you can always access older versions of the page by clicking on the page title. I guess I will add "VIEW" links to the diff links soon. --ArnoHollosi
SingingPraiseToTheLibrary. --HolIgor
i like this idea a lot. well implemented, too.
--adum
Jonathan Cano: I think the anarchic quality of SL is a wonderful strength since I know of so few web sites (much less Go related web sites) that allow so much freedom.
Cheers and thanks for this great site!
A lot of names of contributors are spread through the article, whereas originally it was customary to put the list of authors at the back. I am not criticizing anyone, I am just curious to know the opinion of the people who took the initiative, and other contributors, about how we are evolving.
Arno and I have spent much discussions on this :-) We have not wanted to impose any structure and hence left the wiki as it is at the moment, letting any page belong to any 'type' and changing 'type' several times in its lifetime. I am very interested in all points of view on this issue, so please add your thoughts on this.
(cf Dave's comments a while back on Future Use Of SL)
(Here used to be some comments, now fixed by the aliases. See WikiNews.) It would be nice if there was an "intermediate" difficulty added to the list of page keywords... people are really hesitant to jump to "advanced" yet some things are clearly not beginner subjects.
(unknown)
JanDeWit writes: Out of curiosity, when did SL start? I figure it must be the beginning of November 2000 (digging around for the page which changed the longest time ago). Do you know what (kind & amount of) people lurk here? It would be nice to lure them into contributing (both for theirs and the site's sake!)
MortenPahle: Hmm :-) For the records, I will try to put some things up on SLHistory.
How about Sensei's Tavern? ;-)
I have done a WikiMasterEdit of this page and stored the old page in OldMetadiscussion. Unsolved issues and recent postings remained here. Technical stuff moved back to GuineaPigsFeedback. Created some new discussion pages on a clearly defined topic. --DieterVerhofstadt This is a copy of the living page "Meta Discussion" at Sensei's Library. (C) the Authors, published under the OpenContent License V1.0. |